I don’t think the Scandinavian/Nordic countries were ever actually neutral or non aligned/committed. Even during the 2006 NATO Red Flag military drills, Sweeden was committed to taking the side of “the West” should a NATO country be attacked. This position was made public by having four Gripen military fighter jets participate in the NATO manoeuvre Red Flag back then, where an attack on a NATO country is used as a scenario to test combat readiness. The Gripen jets were even made fully compatible with NATO standards during the manoeuvre. Denmark sent troops to Iraq.
So there is only a surrendering of official/public non committance/neutrality, as in reality Nordic countries have made their commitment to being NATO aligned quite clear over the past few decades.
Sweden sent troops to Afghanistan too, iirc
In hindsight both should’ve joined earlier. But we believed Russia had changed and they wouldn’t actually invade a country in Europe. Proved us wrong.
Russia has done more for NATO than the US has done
More like Nordic countries took their masks off finally, under pressure of a complete final collapse of Anglo empire. Assuming Switzerland would be one of the last ones to fully remove neutrality, unless they can get away without doing it.
What do you mean?
Such a mask off moment to be afraid of Russian aggression after they invaded Ukraine.
“Wait, actions have consequences?” - Russia, probably.
Even ignoring the Ukraine war, was there any possible path for Russia to become militarily aligned with Nordic countries? Countries such as Sweeden, even if they were publicly neutral, have made their position quite clear that they were NATO aligned by participating in NATO military drills since 2006 and integrating with NATO military standards. Thus the Ukraine war has just made these unofficial/more private alignments towards NATO by the Nordic countries public. The writing has been on the wall for decades now with the military alignment of the Nordic countries. The Ukraine war just sped up the timeline.
Even ignoring the Ukraine war, was there any possible path for Russia to become militarily aligned with Nordic countries?
Yes. Simple: Stop being Europe’s black sheep. Advance, politically, past imperial ambitions. Sweden ruled Finland for nearly 700 yet the two get along splendidly, how is that?
Russia was doing a ton of trade in Europe and Finland especially before the invasion of Ukraine. So yea, if Russia had not been doing invasions since like 2008 they would have been in a position to be trusted for military cooperation but their actions taken against neighboring countris has made their other neighbors quite scared of who might be next and thus they allign with NATO for protection. So, yea, the path was not doing invasions and building trust through trade and cooperation.
If there were any advantages to doing so, why not? The issue is there are no advantages and myriad disadvantages to aligning with Russia, if you believe you’re a democratic state.
Why would any democratic state want to align with a totalitarian state unless it was the only option?
Why would any democratic state want to align with a totalitarian state unless it was the only option
So why are they aligning with the USA? The candidate with the most votes has lost 1/3 of US elections in the 21st century, there was an effective judicial coup in 2000, and an attempted coup in 2020. Where has the US and their collective partners ever supported democracy? There was support fascist forces in the Balkans, integration of Eastern Europe into the EU not as equals, but as an effective semi-colony of major Western and Central European countries, similar to the relations between the USA and Latin America. In the global south, through the support of reactionary forces such as political Islam and through direct military intervention, the US has been complicit in the wholesale destruction of societies, as illustrated by Iraq, Syria, Egypt, Libya. I have not even mentioned the situation in Israel, where the USA is actively supporting an apartheid state in Israel and giving them the bombs and ammunition to commit genocide. I have not even mentioned the neo colonialism of the the powerful western and central European countries in Africa.
In what way is any of this democratic by “the West” or the USA? To me, this is the pinnacle of reaction, not progressive or democratic. The true answer to your question has nothing to do with democracy, and rather lies the the first part of your own statement, the Nordic countries think that it is more advantageous to align with “the West” than Russia militarily, and perceive this to be better for their own self interests.
They’re aligning with the US because the other party they could have aligned with has annexed their other ally once already, and then launched a full scale invasion to take more in the last 10 years.
You can say what you want about American democracy and probably be right - but it’s more little d democratic than Russia is currently by leaps and bounds.
One does not need to look at a Supreme Court ruling as a coup to see a dictator at work in Russia.
So why are they aligning with the USA?
They’re really not they’re primarily aligning with the EU which they, you know, are members of. And while EU and US certainly don’t look eye to eye on many issues we’re also not going to go to war with each other any time soon. Not that either side would have any chance invading the other anyway.
Well they can kiss their unions goodbye in about a decade.
NATO is a military alliance, not an economic pact.
Nothing is ever in a bubble.
Sure, but why would a military alliance be of any greater consequence than, say, membership in the European Union?
Because the EU is a loose collection of liberal nations, while NATO was literally started by a nazi to spread anticommunism.
I think the official neutrality already ended with joining the EU.
Man that was a hoot.
As a Pole I smirk at historic neutrality of Sweden after they decided to go over the Baltic and raid half of Poland to the ground in the 17th century.
USA! USA! USA!
Honestly the congratulations from this all go to Russia. Support for NATO never reached 50% prior to this in Finland and it was Russia attacking Ukraine that managed to do what decades and decades of pro-NATO side couldn’t. Almost overnight NATO became really really popular.
Good job, I guess. A real 4D chess move.
