It’s not like any candidate was actually good but they did pick the worst one.
It’s funny, they say fascism happens in slow motion and no one expects it to actually happen until it’s to late.
I really feel like we’re watching it happen in America.
Everyone’s laughing at Trump’s stupidity while the systems to stop fascism are slowly destroyed behind the scenes.
Feels like he’s just a distraction from what’s actually happening.
No one’s laughing at trump’s shit anymore. Anyone with at least a lukewarm iq and even a cursory knowledge of history can see his fascism. It’s just the system is rigged to give regressive areas more voting power
complaining about the rise of fascism
infers anyone who’s not going to vote fascism away is a dunce
mentions lukewarm iq
mentioning iq at all
guess there’s just a predetermined, genetic based, level of intelligence hey mate? scratch a liberal, a fascist bleeds, comrades.
I’m not American, I dont get a vote, I laugh at trump, and all of America, to keep myself from crying.
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It does happen in slow motion, and every single time, some people see it happening. They march and wave their arms shouting FASCISM! whilst their neighbours call them hyperbolic.
If you read contemporaneous accounts, you can feel the frustration.
Or… I thought I could feel the frustration, until recently (eta: if you haven’t read They Thought They Were Free by Milton Mayer, please do as soon as possible). Now it’s doubly frustrating. I keep wracking my brain, wondering what I can do that they didn’t. I can’t stop this, so I keep saying ‘if you were a German in the 1930s, knowing what you know now, what would you do?’
I don’t know the answer to that. I know many Germans saw it coming and couldn’t stop it.
What the fuck can we do? Because it is absolutely coming.
e: oh, and worse, trump isn’t actually the problem. He’ll likely lose, then everyone will high five that we’ve defeated The Problem, but Trump is just their carnival barker. He could die tomorrow and the threat wouldn’t change. There’s a solid fascist movement in the US and elsewhere that will not stop with trump’s defeat. There are thousands of them in high levels of the US government , and they’ll barely miss a beat without trump. He barely matters, and I’m afraid when he loses, the fascist movement behind this will find a wide opening.
Not an answer, but food for thought: https://effectiveactivist.com/
Oooh, neat! Thank you so much for linking this!
Yup, not to say that my country is doing much better or anything, but looking over at the USA it’s almost comical how extremely clear their decline into fascism and decay is. It’d almost be funny if it weren’t so serious.
Unfortunately it’s not hard to see a future where the rest of the world have to fight a war against some future form of christiofascist white supremacist USA.
Not next year or the year after of course, but within my lifetime for sure. People forget how quickly some nations go from progressive and democratic to straight up Third Reich.
It takes a shockingly short amount of time once the slow burn has laid the ground work over the initial decades. The slow burn we’re watching now.
It’s too late.
Fascism isn’t something on the horizon. Look at what is happening in Idaho. Within a year or two half of the US states will have criminalized abortion, and all you hear from federal legislators is how important it is that we shovel more money we don’t have into other countries’ wars.
It’s over.
The only power you or I have left is in our immediate local communities, where you can still accomplish the general good.
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All of those are aspects of fascism. Restricting individual freedoms is a core part of fascism.
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Sad to see you got some downvotes, your takes here are very technically correct and aware of the big picture and actual facts of the mechanisms.
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I hate having to tap the “calling the USSR or other AES states fascist is antisemitic” sign
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My surviving jewish family were freed from a nazi death camp by the people you call fascists. Equating the two is holocaust trivialization and antisemitic. I literally link you to a well known mainstream Jewish historian and activist about this issue. Do you think David Katz is a “tankie”?
You call me scum equivalent to a nazi in response. Have words lost all meaning to you?
Nazi Germany actually had a more liberal view of abortion than the laws that a lot of Republican states are now passing (for reasons that you can probably imagine, but still)
Nazi Germany isn’t the only form of fascism, and had other individual freedoms even more restricted. Nazi Germany was a far-right, reactionary state that violently suppressed Workers and stripped their freedoms, just like American conservatives are attempting to do and are working towards.
How liberal was their view of social equality in regards to varying races?
You DO see how disingenuous your example is, right?
The Nazi stance on abortion wasn’t “liberal”, that’s ludicrous. It ranged from being forbidden for parents of German blood to encouraged or even forced in other cases, it was all about their ideas of racial hygiene. Not even the GOP is that racist, or can you imagine them mandating abortions for mixed-race couples?
The only case where this might be true is even the ban on abortion for German couples did not mean a ban on abortions in medical cases. German (not just Nazi) law generally considers it, as is proper, self-defence. Honestly I don’t think a legal system which doesn’t consider it such can consider itself a legal system at all, Radbruch and everything.
I got banned from a web forum in 2015 for calling Trump a fascist. This shit should not have been any sort of surprise to anybody paying attention.
Read world news. This is in no way just America.
No but this post is about the US
Which Republican candidate would you have preferred to win? Most of them are more fascist than Trump.
At this point it likely doesn’t matter. The US has fucked itself so hard. They’ll either fall or spend decades trying to get back to where they were.
Lol pick a candidate that is likely going to be in prison come election time! Geniuses!
Zero chance he is in prison by election day.
A man’s gotta have a dream
At this point the only things between Trump and a jail cell are:
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The courts must rule in the coming days (probably this month, Jan 2024) that Presidents are subject to criminal prosecution. We know Presidents are not subject to civil prosecution, but the courts are deciding about criminal prosecution now. (Trump argues it would be “bedlam” if Presidents were subject to the law).
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A jury decision in mid 2024. If that jury says “guilty”, it’s over, Trump is a convicted felon.
Do you honestly believe there won’t be any stalling or controversy between now and mid-year that won’t delay it any further?
I don’t know. Once the courts rule he can be prosecuted, and the trial date is already set, I don’t know what other argument can be made to stall.
Trump may or may not eventually end up in prison, but it’s naïve after the past 8 years to assume that there are only two ways this could all shake out, and that you can predict them.
A possibility that will almost certainly be less absurd than whatever actually happens:
Trump wins a second term, manages to get the FedSoc 6 to rule that a sitting president can’t be imprisoned because it would violate separation of powers. So multiple states are just waiting for his term to end so they can actually arrest him. (Feds can’t arrest him because he has pardoned himself for all past, present, and future crimes)
Then in the last month of his presidency he takes a diplomatic trip to Russia and just never comes back.
I don’t mean there are 2 ways this can shake out. I mean there are 2 legal barriers in the way. Once the courts rule that Trump can be prosecuted, then the trial date is set for spring. The judge is motivated to hold to that trial date. The prosecutors have their evidence and arguments ready for the jury.
On the possibility of Trump pardoning himself, it’s not clear that a President can pardon himself and the supreme court would probably end up having to rule on that.
If Trump is a convicted felon, then he probably can’t get enough votes to win, but I don’t know, the cult is strong with this one.
Which means he can’t vote for himself.
Convicted felons can be president.
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Most of the people I know who plan to vote for him think of that as a good thing. It’s the whole “drain the swamp” thing that he’s been rallying people behind for years; they think bad actors in the government are trying to hold Trump down, and him being in jail is just another attempt to do that - from their perspective, electing him even while he’s imprisoned would be a big “fuck you” to those bad actors.
It’s sad that they can’t see that Trump himself is the bad actor, but to most of them, Trump is their last hope to hold on to their beloved world of racism and misogyny, free of any “woke bullshit.” They’ll overlook anything he says or does at this point, since they don’t see any other way forward than through Trump.
I just don’t understand the appeal. Forget all of the gross shit he’s done over the years, the terrible and fraudulent business he’s conducted, he’s just gross period. Like standing there, sounding like a rambling lunatic, not finishing sentences, $10 spray tan, and ill fitting suit. How does that track as “wow what an amazing businessman!”
There is almost no chance they are gonna lock him up. He could openly murder someone with his own hands, on stage, and he would still be able to run in the elections.
Haven’t you heard? He’s the second coming of Christ and his cross is the US legal system.
e: link
After decades of headlines like the one you just posted absolutely nothing has happened.
Trump is bulletproof and he knows it, and now, he doesn’t have to lie about how shitty his opponent in the race is.
I heard that mentioned on MSNBC, 30% of the people who caucused for him say that they would not vote for him if he was convicted.
30% of the people who caucused for him are liars
You fucking jinxed it.
Trying to prosecute him for his real crimes is honestly damaging the election chances of Biden, lots of voters with a vicarious persecution complex through Trump.
Isn’t the point of “conservatives” to tear everything down? Because then they just elected the right man for that.
That’s an accelerationist or a nihilist. If the status quo is pro-immigration and pro-LGBT rights, wanting to keep this status quo will make you a “conservative” because you want to conserve the status quo.
People love to harp about the good ole days
They’re reactionaries.
Nah that’s just how they look from a sane individual’s perspective. They think they’re helping, it would be cute if it wasn’t so fucking sad.
This though. People love to harp about the good ole days but leave out that the good ole days were good cause only cishet white men could participate in the economy
The problem is I actually see Trump winning by breaking every system in the process and the ramifications will be, well, bad
His followers were loyal enough to ransack the Capitol building, what would he have them do in the face of his conviction or disqualification?
Massive Coronary 2024.
The only sane choice.
I think DeSantis might be even worse
Rhonda?
No, that’s Santis.
Damn you! Now that abominable song is stuck in my head and probably will be for the rest of the day! 🤦
He absolutely is. Anyone who thinks Trump is worse is caught up in the media slop. DeSantis is worse.
Not possible. Desantis is too intelligent. No one can be like Trump. No one would risk being so immature and childish. Trump doesn’t risk it because he is that way naturally. Ramaswamy tried but he is a mature person trying to act like Trump which never works.
Someone strapping on a suicide vest would be a more appropriate image.
Yeah, it’s not just his supporters who will get hurt if he gets power again
If the media didn’t want him to win, they shouldn’t have called the race before even 10% of the state got a chance to vote. There’s going to be hundreds, possibly thousands of people who left caucuses early when they heard the race was called. The media is not only complicit in his win there, they have also exposed themselves to retaliation from campaigns and voters alike.
History. Since 1972, the Iowa caucuses have had a 55% success rate at predicting which Democrat, and a 43% success rate at predicting which Republican, will go on to win the nomination of their political party for president at that party’s national convention. Source: Wiki
Honestly, picking Trump again is a good thing for the rest of us. We know he can lose and because of the last presidential election and his base is just getting smaller.
It’s not like any Republican is a good candidate. All of them think abortion is a crime and will appoint shit supreme court justices. So give me the one I know loses because they lost before.
None of the other candidates had a chance at winning. That is not the same as Trump having a chance at losing.
I think he is implying that trump has already lost an election.
As long as everyone who voted before votes again it’s just the same result because neither candidate is running on anything new.
Except Bidens base is also getting smaller. The whole funding a genocide thing isn’t exactly winning him any supporters.
I’m judging bases on data about ages and death. You’re judging bases on feelings from social media.
Biden BARELY beat him the first time around and conditions are WORSE this time around:
1: The electorate has a ridiculously short memory and aren’t currently suffering from Trump being president.
2: Related to but distinct from 1, Biden’s main strategy of “at least I’m not the other guy” is much less effective for an incumbent than a challenger.
3: Biden is currently alienating a large part of his own base by supporting two seperate genocides (Gaza and Yemen), one of which Democrats actually care about even when there’s a Dem president.
Don’t get me wrong, I REALLY want him to win since he’s by far the lesser evil, but for the above reasons and others, there’s a significant risk of him actually losing if the traitor isn’t disqualified as he should be
Biden won by nearly 7 million votes with a 62% of votes under 30 years old and 52% under 45 years old.
Actually the only age group he didn’t win with was 65+ and they’re the ones dropping faster and faster each month.
So you’re assuming people will take Trump over Biden because he was involved in genocide when he was involved in 8 years of drone strike champion before he ran in 2020.
He won the popular vote by a smaller percentage of votes cast than Hillary and the Dem candidate winning the sub-45yo vote is pretty much a given. In most elections, it would be by much more.
As for the 65+ group, a lot of fascists and people who don’t consider fascism more of a deal breaker than a (D) behind a name are aging into that group, perhaps as many as are dying off.
And no, I’m not assuming anything. I’m pointing out that there’s a big risk of the pro-democracy candidate losing if he and the rest of the DNC don’t stop thinking that “Not Trump” is enough and start listening to what the public wants.
I don’t know how to explain to you that you just agreed with me.
You agree that young people vote dem
You agree old people are dying off
But you think Dems will be held accountable by voters by electing a worse candidate for them just to spite the Dems? .
People will take the best option they are provided and 2020 had the highest voter turnout since 1900 for sleepy creepy Joe.
You obviously have a lot more faith in the rationality of voters than I do, in spite of the whole gestures at entire world thing.
In stead of pointing out details, I’m just gonna hope that your faith will be rewarded in a little under 11 months and wish you a nice day.
“I don’t have an argument, but I can’t handle being wrong, so I wrote this to ensure the safety of my ego”
No. I was about to refute their misconceptions point by point but decided it wasn’t worth the effort since we’re ostensibly on the same side and nothing I or anyone else can say would convince them.
Same with you, it seems, so unless you actually have something to add, I suggest you take your conclusion jumping elsewhere.
DeSantis is a much worse choice than trump. I would take trump over him any day of the week.
Desantis has the veneer of sanity, and actually has a clue regarding how to make things worse. He knows exactly what he’s doing. Trump just flails about and expects underlings to figure it out.
My only hope is that people as morally insane as Trump are rare, and there may be a correlation between his sociopathic traits, and how seemingly incompetent he is.
What this hopefully means in practice is that even though this time around he will surround himself with yes-men over which he will have more control, few of them will be precisely like Trump and so not immune to actual concern for the future, and to Trump’s surprise will not all follow his insane ideas without question, as Trump clearly wants everyone to do. He can’t rule on his own. He does need some people, and people needing people requires at least a semblance of regard for others.
In this same way, even his stacked Supreme Court I think will still be likely to put America itself ahead of Trump and a victory that would make a mockery of their own institution, the constitution, and just general common sense.
It’s only a shred of hope, but one which might enable civil society to survive another Trump presidency, and if we’re really lucky, avoid it.
Anyone else looking into viable countries to move to if this shitshow happens again? Whats your top 3 list??
netherlands, denmark, maybe germany, maybe finland. i’d most rather live in the netherlands or possibly denmark, although it’d probably make more sense for me to want to live in germany or finland because i don’t speak dutch or danish lmao. regardless though getting permanent residence in denmark or finland is practically a hopeless goal for a majority of people, so they’re basically out of the question
i can get slovak, maybe german citizenship based on descent (i’m in the process of getting the stuff i need from the slovak government to apply for citizenship but they really take their sweet time) and i’m mostly a software guy so it’d probably make the most sense to move to one of those, however the netherlands probably holds way better opportunities for me
for most people getting into another country (especially europe) is out of the question though, you either have to have extremely marketable work experience (like 3-5 years as an engineer or developer) or you have to happen to qualify for citizenship by descent and have the birth/marriage/death/citizenship/residence documents for it (e.g. anyone who had italian citizenship since 1860, anyone who lived in an area controlled by hungary ever since hungary existed, anyone who was polish 1920 or later, anyone who was czechoslovak or german for the past century, an irish grandfather)
Yea citizenship would be a rough go in some places. Hopefully my work experience at least gets me in and see how it goes from there.
Australian here. Planning my exit too. Probably Finland. Or maybe Ireland.
Yea Ireland is on my short list. Maybe Germany, havent followed their recent politics too much though.
Yeah, I have a sort of free entry to ireland due to it being in my blood but not 100 percent sure.
LOL. Total land slide by just 15% of the votes …where the heck was the rest of the population at? PTA meetings?
It was cold AF. They didn’t want to freeze. The entire Midwest…cold AF right now.
The PNW is also just barely out of the freezer today. Lots of slushy black iced roads and such.
Makes it easier to decide at the actual election. The "RINO"s might be swayed to not vote for drumpf when they might have for someone else.
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